Episode Details

What if the biggest unlock in crypto isn't moving money faster — it's not having to move it at all? Ethan Buchman, co-founder of Cosmos, CEO of Informal Systems, and founder of Cycles, sits down with Alex Kehaya to explain why 16th-century bankers may have understood finance better than we do today — and how he's bringing their playbook on-chain.

From medieval merchant credit networks to a decentralized clearing protocol built for modern crypto market makers, this conversation goes deep into the history of money, why platforms are "dead" in this cycle, and what real product-market fit looks like in 2026.

In this episode:

• 🏛️ A crash course in medieval banking — how Renaissance-era bankers cleared massive trade volumes using almost no money at all
• ⚖️ What "balancing the trade graph" means and why it's the missing piece of modern crypto finance
• 🔗 How Cycles nets out debts on-chain, automatically, without moving funds between parties
• 🏦 Why Cycles is migrating from Cosmos/Neutron to Arc (Circle's new chain) and what that partnership means
• 💸 Cycles' real-world use case: crypto market makers, OTC desks, and liquidity providers settling millions daily with zero clearinghouse
• 📉 Ethan's honest take on the current market, the "infrastructure hangover" in crypto, and why builders need to focus on real users now
• 🚀 Cycles Pay is live in the App Store today — private, on-chain payments and invoicing

🔗 Links mentioned:

• Cycles: https://cycles.money/
• Cycles on X: https://x.com/cyclesmoney
• Ethan Buchman on X: https://x.com/buchmanster
• Ethan Buchman on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ethan-buchman-10b34944/
• The Index Podcast: https://www.youtube.com/@theindexpodcast

Show Links

The Index
X Channel
YouTube