Episode Details
Back to Episodes“A Modest Proposal: Why Vegans Should Start Factory Farms” by moral_mazes
Description
TL;DR: The animal welfare movement has been doing advocacy wrong. If we’re serious about ending factory farming, vegans need to start running factory farms ourselves. I lay out the case below and address common objections.
The Core Argument
For decades, the animal welfare movement has operated from the outside: funding investigations, lobbying for regulation, producing documentaries, and encouraging dietary change. The results have been modest at best. Global meat consumption continues to rise.
I believe we need a fundamentally different approach. The people who care most about animal suffering should be the ones running factory farms.
Here's why.
If We Don’t Do It, Someone Worse Will
Factory farming is going to happen regardless of what we do. The demand exists. The economics are clear. If compassionate, welfare-focused vegans don’t step up to operate these facilities, they’ll be run by people who don’t care about animals at all. By entering the industry ourselves, we ensure that at least some factory farms are operated by people who are genuinely troubled by what they’re doing. This is obviously preferable to a world where all factory farms are run by people who aren’t troubled in the slightest.
We Need to Be Close [...]
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Outline:
(00:28) The Core Argument
(01:00) If We Don't Do It, Someone Worse Will
(01:37) We Need to Be Close to the Frontier
(02:28) Responsible Farming Policies
(03:26) A Seat at the Table
(04:13) Funding the Mission
(05:20) Why not just study animals without farming them?
(06:31) Community Impacts
(07:24) Addressing Objections
(07:28) "This is just factory farming with a mission statement."
(07:53) "Your incentives will shift once you're running the operation."
(08:19) "External advocacy and regulation would be more effective."
(09:00) Aren't you providing the industry with moral cover?
(09:38) What about cognitive biases and groupthink?
(10:14) You're just enriching yourself with status, influence, and resources while socializing risks
(11:14) What's your main safety plan?
(11:49) You're just moving fast and breaking beaks
(12:03) Aren't you worried the chickens might escape and destroy you and everything you love?
(12:21) What about a coordinated pause?
(12:48) What about dialogue with China?
(12:58) What's it like to have Bernie Sanders, Steve Bannon, writers, artists, musicians, teachers, and the general public all broadly opposed to what you're doing?
(13:30) What would it take to convince you this approach is wrong?
(13:39) This plan sounds crazy
(13:48) Our Team
(14:27) Call to Action
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First published:
August 13th, 2026
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Narrated by TYPE III AUDIO.