Episode Details

Welcome to the Leading Edge in Emotionally Focused Therapy, hosted by Drs. James Hawkins, Ph.D., LPC, and Ryan Rana, Ph.D., LMFT, LPC—Renowned ICEEFT Therapists, Supervisors, and Trainers. We're thrilled to have you with us. We believe this podcast, a valuable resource, will empower you to push the boundaries in your work, helping individuals and couples connect more deeply with themselves and each other.

We aim to equip therapists with practical tools and encouragement for addressing relational distress. We're also excited to be part of the team behind Success in Vulnerability (SV)—your premier online education platform. SV offers innovative instruction to enhance your therapeutic effectiveness through exclusive modules and in-depth clinical examples.

🔥 The “Crazy Eights” (Two Lists of 8) 1. 8 Stage 2 Targets (Where to Go)

These are the deepest places where transformation happens:

1. Individual trauma (moments of being overwhelmed without escape)
2. Disowned parts of self (rejected to survive connection)
3. Attachment injuries (relational “never again” moments)
4. Significant loss (grief that reshapes attachment)
5. Family-of-origin wounds (roles, neglect, triangulation)
6. Early/formative relational experiences (first heartbreaks, betrayals)
7. Negative working model of self (“I am not enough”)
8. Fear of reaching + deepest attachment longings

2. 8 Scene Evocation Cues (How to Get There)

Used to unlock deep emotional processing:

1. What do you see?
2. What are the colors/details in the room?
3. What is the temperature?
4. What are you sitting on?
5. What is touching your body (clothes, textures)?
6. What do you hear?
7. What is happening in others’ eyes/faces?
8. What do you notice in your body right now?

💡 Top 10 Nuggets from the Show

1. Stage 2 is about building co-regulation bridges, not just insight.
2. You cannot revise what has never been fully experienced.
3. Therapists must go toward pain, not around it.
4. Safety is not the same as comfort.
5. If you avoid shame, you will also avoid transformation.
6. Emotion must be somatically alive to create lasting change.
7. “Fear” is not enough—you must access the meaning beneath the fear.
8. Deep work lowers relapse because the body learns a new path.
9. Clients don’t need to be taught—they need to experience something new.
10. Therapy is most powerful when we help clients say the unsayable.

We aim to equip therapists with practical tools and encouragement for addressing relational distress. We're also excited to be part of the team behind Success in Vulnerability (SV)—your premier online education platform. SV offers innovative instruction to enhance your therapeutic effectiveness through exclusive modules and in-depth clinical examples.

 Stay connected with us:

• Facebook: Follow our page @pushtheleadingedge
• Ryan: Follow @ryanranaprofessionaltraining on Facebook and visit his website
• James: Follow @dochawklpc on Facebook and Instagram, or visit his website at dochawklpc.com
• George Faller: Visit georgefaller.com

If you like the concepts discussed on this podcast you can explore our online training program, Success in Vulnerability (SV).

Thank you for being part of our community. Let's push the leading edge together!