Episode Details

Summary
A CFO hands HR a layoff list. HR runs the numbers and finds it disproportionately skews toward employees over 55 and women in senior roles. The CFO says it's based on performance ratings. HR pulls the data and finds significant rating inconsistencies. The CFO wants to proceed. Now what? 

In this episode of HR Voices, host Rebecca Taylor sits down with Lizzie Garner, Chief People Officer at ClearChoice Dental Implant Centers, to work through this fabricated-but-deeply-familiar scenario about the moment HR has to decide whether to push back, proceed, or put themselves on the list. 

Lizzie brings a refreshingly grounded perspective rooted in having led more layoffs than most HR leaders ever will. She walks through why layoffs are actually the moment HR can build the most trust and value within an organization, how to reframe "going over the CFO's head" as "let's bring in another brain," and why she's never used performance ratings as the sole selection criteria for a reduction in force. 

She and Rebecca get into alternative selection approaches like last-in-first-out and full role elimination, why reminding the CFO of the cost of employment litigation is one of your most effective tools, and the practical scripting details that matter most in the actual conversation with someone being let go—including leading with "everything we discuss today will be emailed to you" because nothing else will register after that moment. If you're an HR leader navigating a reduction or preparing for one, Lizzie's toolkit approach and her steady composure will give you something concrete to build from.

Timestamps

• 01:37 The scenario: the layoff order
• 02:31 Why layoffs are actually where HR can build the most trust
• 06:08 Getting involved before the list exists: selection criteria conversations
• 09:31 Running the impact analysis and bringing in outside counsel
• 11:25 Reminding the CFO what employment litigation actually costs
• 13:01 Alternative approaches: last-in-first-out and full role elimination
• 18:03 Reframing "going over their head" as "let's bring in another brain"
• 26:17 Scripting the actual layoff conversation: lead with the email, hold space

Takeaways

• Get involved before the layoff list exists—advocate for clear selection criteria when the conversation is still about cost-saving, not names
• Run a full impact analysis and consider bringing in outside counsel for a second set of eyes on disproportionate impact
• Offer alternative selection methods like last-in-first-out or full role elimination to give the CFO defensible options
• Remind finance leaders that employment litigation is expensive—sometimes the cost of proceeding outweighs the savings
• Script the layoff conversation carefully: open with "everything we discuss today will be emailed to you" because nothing after that will register
• Build a reduction-in-force toolkit before you need one—you'll be seen as the expert, and you probably are, even if it's your first time

Guest LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lizziegarner

Company website: https://www.clearchoice.com

Sponsor

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• (01:37) - The scenario: the layoff order
• (02:31) - Why layoff