Episode Details

“Lynn Margulis said about 9/11 the same sorts of things that you mentioned people like her were saying about AIDS, which is that, if this stands, it's the death of science. Reason and facts aren't going to matter anymore when something this obviously wrong is forced down everybody's throats.”

Ex-MSM journalist Celia Farber was friends with the late, great biologist Lynn Margulis, who memorably wrote: “The 9/11 tragedy is the most successful and most perverse publicity stunt in the history of public relations.” Margulis, a National Medal of Science winner, stated more than once on my radio show that due to the scientific community’s tacit acceptance of the ludicrous, physically-impossible official story of 9/11, “science is dead.”

So who killed science, and why? Lynn Margulis knew that 9/11 and its criminally fraudulent coverup was just an extreme example of the deep-seated corruption that has crept into the American scientific community. Another shocking example, well-known to Margulis and other scientific luminaries but largely ignored by the general public, is the long-running dispute around the causes and treatments for AIDS. Decades ago, mainstream journalist Celia Farber reported on the efforts of Lynn Margulis and so many other scientists to debunk what they saw as the scientifically-baseless insistence that “HIV causes AIDS.” Farber, and the scientists whose work she covered, were targeted by a vicious smear campaign not unlike those endured by 9/11 truth advocates.

After COVID became a sort of AIDS 2.0, Farber recognized that the problem was even bigger and uglier than she had realized. That stimulated her interest in red-pill perspectives in general, and ultimately led her to accept my request for an interview. Below is a transcript of our conversation. -KB

I’m on the web at kevinbarrett.substack.com. And I've had the great good fortune to talk to a lot of really wonderful, interesting people through the years—the free and independent thinkers who question dogmas about all sorts of events, 9-11 and COVID being two of the big ones. Now I'm talking with somebody who actually was around back in the days when you were allowed to question some of these things a little bit more than you are now, and even publish in the mainstream media about them.

My guest today is Celia Farber. She is well known as the journalist who broke one of the biggest stories of my lifetime, which is that the official version of the AIDS epidemic is very likely wrong, or even worse. This is something I've been hearing for decades. I followed it a little bit back at the time. And later I met Lynn Margulis, the great biologist, who filled me in a little bit more.

One of the cool things about doing what I do is that so many of the best people like you (Celia) have to end up on my show instead of being on 60 Minutes or something and having that huge mainstream audience that you really deserve based on the work that you've done. But I guess I can't complain. The mainstream’s loss is my gain.

So where do we start? You mentioned in our pre-broadcast conversation that the AIDS situation was really a kind of a prequel to the COVID pandemic. I was sort of marginally aware of your work back in in the 80s and 90s. I did live in San Francisco from 1981 through 1993. I knew people with AIDS and I followed the discussion in the mainstream and alternative media around it, and I'm sure I did see a fair bit of your work.

I got the gist of it back then. And then I reviewed it a little bit with Bobby Kennedy's book (

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